From: Mick McQuaid (mcquaid_at_u.arizona.edu)
Date: Fri May 03 2002 - 19:41:54 EDT
So the short answer is that you know of no case
where MS has successfully prosecuted, right?
... regarding a message from STeve Andre' on May 03:
> I'd like to think that, but why then is it the EULA, End User
> License Agreement?
>
> Just because they haven't in the past doesn't mean they
> might not in the future.
>
> You may not have direct dealings with MS, but it's still
> MS's software, isn't it. Thus even though you didn't
> enter into the contract directly, you are still obgliated
> to its terms, because you are using it. I know there is
> case precedent for that; I've talked with computer
> aware lawyers who have explained this to me.
>
> Sadly, MS can--and perhaps will-try to enforce all sorts
> of things to stay on top. Look at the XP license, and how
> it's changed. Look at Office XP and how it says, somwhere,
> that you will only run it on Windows.
>
> MS is scared to death of the GPL world, and at the same
> time trying to control people stealing from it (like Asia, for
> example).
>
> At this point I wouldn't bet that they wouldn't try some high
> visibility prosecutions of EULA breechs, for the "educational"
> impact on others.
>
> I think you need to talk with a lawyer on this. You are bound
> by the licensing agreement as far as I know.
>
> --STeve Andre'
>
> On Friday 03 May 2002 06:39 pm, John Poltorak wrote:
> > On Fri, May 03, 2002 at 06:27:48PM -0400, richard wrote:
> > > it may be compete nonsense. but it's the law.
> >
> > No it isn't.
> >
> > When I buy a computer, I do not have any direct dealings with Microsoft. I
> > enter into a contract with the retailer. I pay the retailer money, I get a
> > computer in return. Microsoft has no claims on me or what I can do with
> > the goods I bought apart from breaking copyright law which applies to
> > everyone not just Microsoft. I have no legal relationship with Microsoft.
> > I made no agreement with them.
> >
> > On what possible basis can they initiate an action on someone with whom
> > they have had no exchange?
> >
> > Please give me a single instance of Microsoft suing a purchaser of a
> > computer for failing to comply with the EULA.
> >
> > It is simply bluff and does not carry any weight at all.
> >
> > > At 11:21 PM 5/3/2002 +0100, John Poltorak wrote:
> > > >On Fri, May 03, 2002 at 05:51:03PM -0400, Richard Chalk wrote:
> > > > > This is not all-that complicated. One does not buy the software, but
> > > > > the right to use it. That right is conveyed by the license
> > > > > certificate that comes with the software, or, in the case of a
> > > > > factory-installed
> > > >
> > > > machine, the
> > > >
> > > > > certificate comes with the machine.
> > > >
> > > >No, this is complete nonesense.
> > > >
> > > >How can a person who buys his first computer, gets it home and starts it
> > > >be told after the event that he doesn't own the software? It doesn't
> > > > make any sense. You never sign anything to say you agree to abide by
> > > > the terms of the EULA. It is a complete sham and I doubt whether it has
> > > > any legal status at all, at least not in the EU. Software is often
> > > > consider to be like a book, from a legal point of view. The book is
> > > > yours and you can read it and then sell it. You don't need to ask the
> > > > authors permission to do so.
> > > >
> > > > > The fact that there is software installed on a machine you buy
> > > > > second-hand does not mean that you have the license to use it. You
> > > > > are responsible for obtaining the license from the seller, or,
> > > > > alternatively, buying a new license, since if you did not receive it
> > > > > with the computer, the license
> > > >
> > > > will
> > > >
> > > > > still belong to the original purchaser.
> > > > >
> > > > > Now, let's all swear on whatever is holy that we adhere rigidly to
> > > > > the above.
> > > >
> > > >This is simply Microsoft speak. As far I'm concerned, if I get Windows
> > > > on a system, I am free to do anything I want with it including give it
> > > > away, although not making copies of it for sale. I was forced into
> > > > paying for it anyway, since I didn't want it. But no one seems to care
> > > > about this.
> > > >
> > > >Bill Gates is welcome to come banging on my door if he wants and tell me
> > > > I have broken his EULA, but I haven't since it is void, IMV.
> > > >
> > > > > Richard
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >John
--
Mick McQuaid, mcquaid_at_u.arizona.edu
520-621-4074 office / voice mail
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