From: Andrew Wells (ajwells_at_ix.netcom.com)
Date: Mon Nov 25 2002 - 12:29:48 EST
Oh I know my response may have been over the top... but a laptop is such
a personal item that it invites such responses... I know that my T23 was
not designed to be so significantly inferior to the 600 series, but I
have seen enough of them that friends and associates have to know that
mine is pretty typical of the breed... for them these aspects are not a
problem, but when I have days where I have to switch back between my
600x and my T23 the difference to me is astounding... it's a subjective
call
Unfortunately my keyboard is fully seated and installed properly... its
just that the design doesn't provide any support for the keyboard as it
does in the 600 series... you can put your figer into the card slot and
push against the keyboard and feel and see it bending and flexing... and
I've done that with a few of them so its not only mine
I am still an IBM customer because of the warranty and reliability, and
I do appreciate the built in wireless and the ability to run larger
external screens from my T23... but I do wish that they would turn their
attention back to design and quality...
Hope I didn't come off as ranting before... I was just throwing some
observations out there for consideration by people who are similarly
design and build conscious
Andrew
-----Original Message-----
From: thinkpad-admin_at_stderr.org [mailto:thinkpad-admin_at_stderr.org] On
Behalf Of Penzance - NetFinity
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 8:34 AM
To: Andrew Wells; thinkpad_at_cs.utk.edu
Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] Un-Crappy ThinkPads
andrew..
i made a long winded reply to this after midnight last night, then
decided
it was a bit verbose..
the short reply is that while competitive pressures from others is
driving
prices down, IMO IBM is still the leader..
your T23 was not designed to be so crummy..
hinges: a warranty item.. should be smooth as silk.. sometimes they wear
and
become dry and sticky..
keyboard: subjective unless it is not fully seated.. it IS a CRU..!
heat: yup, they get hot when the fan does not run.. and even when it
DOES
run, the left side palm rest get hot.. but a sauna like temp level..??
but with the recent self serving insanity coming from the memphis repair
facility i too would be hesitant to send anything there..
even though i DID send an X20 in for a good screwing.. (forgive me.. the
top
cover screws were loose and i just could not resist the temptation)
*******************
Cordially,
Bill Morrow
(from NetFinity Server)
web page: http://www.thinkpads.com
bill_at_thinkpads.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew Wells" <ajwells_at_ix.netcom.com>
To: <thinkpad_at_cs.utk.edu>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:17 AM
Subject: RE: [Thinkpad] Un-Crappy ThinkPads
> I use a T23 every day, but it creaks and groans as you open the case,
> the keyboard is mush and it radiates heat up through the keyboard like
a
> sauna... for my money the best TP by a mile is the 600x, which appears
> to be the peak of the design/build/size/speed matrix... of course I
need
> to run a bigger external screen a lot of the time and use the built in
> wireless of the T23 so I put up with the bad design and build
quality...
> I go into clients homes all the time and see them with their A and T
> series computers and ask them how they like them, to which they always
> reply "oh Thinkpads are the best!"... but then you ask them about all
> these aspects and they always agree about them, now that they stop and
> think about it... which makes me think that IBM is probably right in
> cutting quality corners... although consumers would prefer a better
> designed and built machine, they don't demand it... so why give it to
> them? Clearly a lot of profit was left on the table designing and
> building the 600 series... lets hope they make some of that back with
> the A, T and X series...
>
> Oh I did see a T30 at a clients home and was very unimpressed... the
> casing now looks and feels much thicker and bulkier on the bottom and
> although the screen opens more smoothly than the T series, the
keyboard
> still smokes and is mushy and a lot of the plastic is loose and ill
> fitting... ah progress!
>
> Andrew Wells
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thinkpad-admin_at_stderr.org [mailto:thinkpad-admin_at_stderr.org] On
> Behalf Of RayBay
> Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 12:20 AM
> To: shamanjp
> Subject: [Thinkpad] Un-Crappy ThinkPads
>
> 385 ED, 386 XD, 390, 390 E, 390 X, 560Z, 570 E, 760 XL, 760 XD, 765 L,
> 765 D, 770 ED, 770 X, 770 Z, 600, 600e, and the 600X as the best of
the
> bunch. Ignoring, of course, the unreliable floppy drives of most of
> them, and the quickly wearing keyboards of the 760 and 760. The 600
> series has few weaknesses.
>
> Out of the recent models, both the T and A series are looking good,
but
> it is early... the A-21, A-22, A-30, A-31, and T-21, T-22, T-23, and
> T-30
> seem to be the best of these... but it will take a while to know which
> model letters will apply to the most reliable list. Perhaps the X-21
> and X-22 if you don't include the peripherals.
>
> shamanjp wrote:
> >
> > After following this Crappy Thinkpad conversation I got to thinking
> that it
> > would be interesting and useful to hear opinions on which would be
> > considered the most reliable models.
>
> --
>
>
> "I know what you're thinking about," said Tweedledum;
> but it isn't so, nohow."
> "Contrariwise," continued Tweedledee, "if it was so, it
> might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't
> it ain't. That's logic."
>
> Through the Looking-Glass
>
>
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